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Thread: Not So ‘Standard’ Anymore: The Manual Transmission is Almost Dead

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    Senior Member Ajijic's Avatar
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    Not So ‘Standard’ Anymore: The Manual Transmission is Almost Dead

    Not So ‘Standard’ Anymore: The Manual Transmission is Almost Dead
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    We knew it was happening, but the actual extent of three pedal abandonment remained somewhat elusive. It was more of a feeling than a grim statistical representation. Now we have a number, and it’s dismal.


        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2016 Micra Active manual: 6.0 L/100 km ... 46.9 mpg (Imp) ... 16.6 km/L ... 39.0 mpg (US) ...


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    Member Grok's Avatar
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    I think this is a North America phenomena. A couple of years ago, when my wife was in Germany, France and Czechoslovakia, she said it was very hard to find an automatic equipped rental. I found that quite surprising, I prefer the simplicity and reliability of a manual myself.

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    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    Manuals are definitely more popular overseas. I disagree with the comment that they don't give better control. IMO they definitely give you better control. If they were geared properly (again IMO), they'd also still get much better fuel economy than automatics. Alas, OEMs don't want the car to feel doggy even in top gear, so they shy away from that. It seems people can't be bothered to downshift anymore.

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    Senior Member Ajijic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daox View Post
    Manuals are definitely more popular overseas. I disagree with the comment that they don't give better control. IMO they definitely give you better control. If they were geared properly (again IMO), they'd also still get much better fuel economy than automatics. Alas, OEMs don't want the car to feel doggy even in top gear, so they shy away from that. It seems people can't be bothered to downshift anymore.
    Here is an article you may find interesting:

    Five Myths About Stick Shifts: Manual vs Automatic Transmissions


    Manual Transmissions Aren't Always Cheaper, More Fuel-Efficient

    There are other examples as well. For the 2014 Versa, Nissan actually offers three transmissions: a five-speed manual, a four-speed automatic and a continuously variable transmission (CVT). The manual and automatic get the same combined fuel economy (30 mpg), but the CVT blows both of them away with 35 mpg. And it's not just economy cars where you can find this trend: A 2013 BMW 328i sedan will get the same combined fuel economy (26 mpg) whether you opt for the manual or automatic transmission.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2016 Micra Active manual: 6.0 L/100 km ... 46.9 mpg (Imp) ... 16.6 km/L ... 39.0 mpg (US) ...


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    Administrator Daox's Avatar
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    I understand that many automatics and CVTs today get better mileage than their manual transmission alternatives. I also understand why this is.

    If you look only at the transmission portion of the equation (exclude engine, etc), the efficiency of a manual transmission can not be beat. Energy loss is around 1% per gear set. I used to work at a gearbox manufacturer, and this is a common calculation for heat generation used by engineers. Automatics loose massive amounts of efficiency from their torque converters when they aren't locked up. Thankfully, auto makers have been more and more aggressive with locking up torque converters. CVTs also use torque converters, and their belts are not as efficient as a geared connection.

    So, with the manual transmission actually being more efficient than other automatics, why do they get lower mileage? Mainly, because people are lazy. They don't like to downshift. They like power and they like it now, not after downshifting. Thus, auto makers design their top gear quite short in my opinion. So, while the manual transmission itself is very efficient, it cruises at a much higher rpm than its automatic counterparts. This runs the engine in an inefficient manner and you loose more fuel economy than the more efficient manual can provide.

    However, if you were to gear the automatic, CVT, and manual transmission all the same, you would clearly see that the manual transmission would return the best fuel economy of the three. Its also extremely common for auto makers to gear transmissions taller to increase fuel economy ratings on cars. But, its always a balancing act between available power and efficiency in top gear.

    I suppose one example of an automatic transmission that would be nearly as efficient as a manual would be a dual clutch transmission (DCT). There is no torque converter, so that helps a lot. However, it still has powered components that will eat up power in the form of hydraulics or electricity that the manual transmission doesn't have.

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    Administrator MetroMPG's Avatar
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    It's sad that the manual is dying. I get so much more enjoyment out of driving stick.

    It's also sad that one reason it's dying is because of "misinformation" about automatics being more efficient.

    I say it's "misinformation" because the fuel economy tests dictate what engine RPM the manual tranmission test driver must shift at, and they're NOT fuel-efficient shift points. If all you do is shift at moderate RPM, and go for the highest gear you can use once you're finished accelerating, then you will beat the automatic.

    Remember the auto vs. manual Micra comparison? The manual blew it out of the water, even though the ratings are nearly identical:

    Thread: Head to head: 2015 Micra manual vs. automatic MPG/fuel economy comparison

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Micra S manual: 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.5 mpg (Imp) ... 20.0 km/L ... 47.0 mpg (US) ...


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    Administrator MetroMPG's Avatar
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    Versa Note: auto only

    Oh - I also read there's news from Nissan about this.

    They have dropped the manual transmission Versa Note in the U.S. It's CVT only now.

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Micra S manual: 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.5 mpg (Imp) ... 20.0 km/L ... 47.0 mpg (US) ...


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    Senior Member micrapolis's Avatar
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    surprised to hear that. you'd think the cheapest car in the US would offer, ya know, the cheapest tranny possible...

    i like manuals. but my love for them is subjective, sentimental type.

    objectively, i always live in stop and go, urban areas. sometimes hills. so.....eh.

    in the long term, with the advent of PHEVs and EVs, manual trannys are living in borrowed time, even in Eurolandia.
    Vancouver SNOWpocalypse !!!!1!11!one (....not really)

    https://youtu.be/IZcz-MqjuzQ

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    Member caspiansea's Avatar
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    As you get older and have driven stick your whole life it starts to affect your amrs your legs shifting using just youf left arm to drive. I am feeling it now after long days but I still dig my standard and shifting lol



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