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Thread: My daughters first car

  1. #11
    Senior Member AlphaMicra's Avatar
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    My son is also coming of age and will be old enough for a new car, but I won't be getting him a Micra. Why not? Quite simply, insurance. Micra's tend to land in the higher range of insurance. They're not as bad as some, but they're still up there. Instead, I'll be buying him a used Chevrolet Impala. As much as I have a distaste for GM, there's no denying the fact that it is, by and large, the least expensive vehicle to insure for a new young driver.

    It might be different for young women, but I think it's worthwhile checking out. The money she saves on insurance might be enough to go towards something worthwhile.



    In our culture obsessed with absurd excess, the Nissan Micra is my counterculture car of choice.
    Be sure to visit my blog at mymicra.com!

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Micra SV manual: 6.4 L/100 km ... 44.3 mpg (Imp) ... 15.7 km/L ... 36.9 mpg (US) ...


  2. #12
    Senior Member Vapor's Avatar
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    Unless it's liability only insurance, I can't imagine his savings being more than he will spend on the extra fuel and maintenance.

    I think the peace of mind that your child is not going to break down on the side of the road, or develop a costly mechanical or electrical issue for which there is no warrenty is very "worthwhile" so to speak.
    Last edited by Vapor; 08-25-2016 at 02:36 AM.

  3. #13
    Senior Member AlphaMicra's Avatar
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    I'm afraid you're wrong, Vapor. Between ages 18 and 21, assuming a travel distance of 20,000 km per year and gas prices at $1.00 per liter (currently around 92-93 cents per liter at Costco Oshawa), a used Impala would generate a total savings of $1,209.12 over that four year period. If we assume each vehicle to be sold after 4 years, and given current rates of depreciation, the Impala would net an overall savings of $4,618.24. Even if you keep the Micra for 20 years after buying it, and then plan to sell it for a scrap value of $500, the Impala is still ahead by $2,318.24 over that four year period. Here's an image of the spreadsheet I created to perform these calculations, based on insurance quotes, fuelly.com data, and prices estimated from the local auto trader:
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    You are correct that the Impala insurance quote is without collision, which is a good thing: As a young driver, every claim you make will cause your rates to go up significantly. You really don't have a choice on the Micra; it'd be crazy to not have collision on a $10,000 car, while $4,000 is easier to handle, as that's just about what insurance in the first year will cost.

    As for peace of mind, you do understand that we are comparing Chevrolet's flagship sedan to Nissan's cheapest, bottom of the line car, right? The Impala has been rated high for both reliability and safety fairly consistently over the past decade. In fact, sites like mojomotors.com recommends the Chevrolet Impala (post 2005) as a "High mileage vehicle you can (and should) buy." http://www.mojomotors.com/review/hig...ould-buy/#Full size

    My main concern for my son is his safety. He's fairly new at driving, and while I expect him to be a responsible driver, he doesn't have the experience I have. I'm more concerned about the idiot drivers hitting him, as he may be more easily caught off guard from, say, a person running a red light. All else being equal, he will be significantly safer in a bigger, heavier vehicle for those first four years.
    http://www.iihs.org/iihs/topics/t/ve...d-weight/qanda

    As for the Micra's warranty, don't go there. I've already got a check engine light, but at 86,000km, I'm out of warranty. You'd have to buy brand new, which means an even higher purchase price, higher costs year after year, and it's still a small car that's simply not going to provide the protection I want my son to have. Maintenance isn't covered under warranty, and would not represent a significant difference in expense between the two cars.

    In our culture obsessed with absurd excess, the Nissan Micra is my counterculture car of choice.
    Be sure to visit my blog at mymicra.com!

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Micra SV manual: 6.4 L/100 km ... 44.3 mpg (Imp) ... 15.7 km/L ... 36.9 mpg (US) ...


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    Ajijic (08-26-2016),micrapolis (08-28-2016)

  5. #14
    Senior Member Vapor's Avatar
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    To each his own again I could argue this all day, a $4000 impala pegs it at about 10 years old. Right about the time most wearable parts should be wearing out again for the second time. I think your assuming your 10 year old impala is getting the advertised fuel economy it got new. It won't, new ones didn't either. Flagship sedans tend to have more expensive parts than their economy counterparts. The Micra being my first new car I know buying a used car is like playing the reverse lottery. It's all about the next time you win, usually for me about it was about once every 2-4 months. From master cylinders to seized calipers, wheel bearings to driveshaft bearings. That's a nice spreadsheet but I've had a few good 10 year old cars, none of them actually made it to the four year mark before I was done spending money on them. But good luck to your son.
    Last edited by Vapor; 08-26-2016 at 01:52 PM.

  6. #15
    Senior Member AlphaMicra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    To each his own again I could argue this all day, a $4000 impala pegs it at about 10 years old. Right about the time most wearable parts should be wearing out again for the second time.
    That price is safety and certified, not "As is." A 10 year old Impala "As is" is nearly half the price. The safety inspection for a used car in Ontario is now very rigorous, and pretty much covers those wearable parts. I enjoin you to read this excellent article about it: http://www.autotrader.ca/newsfeature...OjyTWUprBPs.97

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    I think your assuming your 10 year old impala is getting the advertised fuel economy it got new. It won't, new ones didn't either.
    Actually, I already mentioned I got the data from fuelly.com, from an average of input that had been entered by owners of similar models over the past year, so the fuel mileage for these cars is actually very accurate and up to date. I can confirm the data on an older car when comparing data to my own 2009 Pontiac Torrent.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    Flagship sedans tend to have more expensive parts than their economy counterparts.
    Untrue. It's actually the high end and the low end models that have more expensive parts, many that are dealer-only. The Impala enjoys a rich and varied aftermarket source for pretty much anything it might need. In addition, since the model runs went for so long between changes, the scrap yards offer a plentiful source of cheap, good parts...unlike the Micra, where even the front brake pads right now are dealer only items at $120.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    The Micra being my first new car I know buying a used car is like playing the reverse lottery. It's all about the next time you win, usually for me about it was about once every 2-4 months. From master cylinders to seized calipers, wheel bearings to driveshaft bearings. That's a nice spreadsheet but I've had a few good 10 year old cars, none of them actually made it to the four year mark before I was done spending money on them.
    Doesn't sound like anything you bought compared to a 10 year old, $4000 Impala...sounds more to me like a 10 year old, high mileage, sub-$500 "Needs some TLC or for parts" economy 4 banger deal. A 10 year old "As is" Chevrolet Cavalier with 300,000 km is not the same as a 10 year old certified Impala with 145,000km, because in part the Impala was built better with better quality components, and in part because, at this age, mileage makes a huge difference.

    For comparison, here's an average 16 year old Impala, being sold e-tested and with a safety inspection today:
    http://wwwa.autotrader.ca/a/Chevrole...O&orup=9_15_10

    I'd bet whoever buys that would still probably get two or three more years out of it at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vapor View Post
    But good luck to your son.
    He's a pretty smart kid on a good path in life. Lucky for him to have a father who knows a thing or two about cars and money.

    In our culture obsessed with absurd excess, the Nissan Micra is my counterculture car of choice.
    Be sure to visit my blog at mymicra.com!

        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Micra SV manual: 6.4 L/100 km ... 44.3 mpg (Imp) ... 15.7 km/L ... 36.9 mpg (US) ...


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  8. #16
    Senior Member micrapolis's Avatar
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    vapor: your post on the first page was super useful thanks. can you tell me more about this part:

    Wheels. They are 4x100 which means that we should have the best selection of cheap wheels ever since all those old civic owners thought they were race car owners made a huge market for 4x100 rims. Wrong. FOr some reason Nissan went with a 60mm centrebore as opposed to Honda's 54mm. Most 4x100 rims will not fit, they have to have at least a 60mm centrebore. (I'm getting picky now.)
    im very ignorant when it comes to tires...are you saying our Micra uses uncommon tire form factors?

    alphamicra: as much as i love my micra, i have to agree with you: used, compact or midsize vehicles that are beaters are much much better for first time drivers. why? cuz you know they will get all sorts of fender benders, and better to do that on an older car that you wont cry tears for. and also , safety as you mentioned.

    as modern as our micra is, at the end of the day, a sedan is just safer, as long as that sedan was made in the last decade-ish.
    Vancouver SNOWpocalypse !!!!1!11!one (....not really)

    https://youtu.be/IZcz-MqjuzQ

  9. #17
    Senior Member Vapor's Avatar
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    Not uncommon tire, it's an uncommon rim. The center hole has to be bigger than most other cars with this type of bolt pattern.

  10. #18
    Administrator MetroMPG's Avatar
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    minimicra2016, any update?

    Did you test out a Micra?


        __________________________________________

        click to view fuel log View my fuel log 2015 Micra S manual: 5.0 L/100 km ... 56.5 mpg (Imp) ... 20.0 km/L ... 47.0 mpg (US) ...


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